Handley Page O/400 vs. Gotha G .IV

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Which was the better bomber?


I chose the Gotha G .IV over the Gotha G .V because of the large impact it had in bombing Britain in WWI. One of the first of it's kind to do so, it deserves it's place in history when it was used to attack an enemy city.



The Gotha G .V, while it had some improvements over the IV, did not have the effect it's predecessor had.

I chose the Handley Page Type O/400 over the Handley Page Type O/100 for the same reason. The O/400 and was deployed in greater numbers, and had a larger payload.

The Handley V/1500, nicknamed the "Super Handley", was an improvement over it's relatives and did well in the Third Anglo-Afghan War, but was built too late too see much service in WWI.

The Handley was the definitive British bomber of WWI, and for a while after all large planes were called "Handley's" in Britain.

The Gotha G. was one of the most feared weapons of the Luftwaffe, and the pyschological effects it had was immense. It's actions in WWI were a forerunner of the Heinkel He 111's bombing of Britain in WWII.

[Glider]

I went for the 0400 mainly on the much larger payload that it carried.
I think the biggest bomb was the 1,600lb bomb. By WW1 standards this must have seemed like the end of the world when it went off.

[Graeme]

One "outstanding" feature of the Gotha was the "sting in the tail." They had a specially made plywood tunnel in the rear fuselage allowing the gunner to fire backwards and downwards through an arc of 25 degrees laterally and 60 degrees vertically...





With the Mercedes engines it had a high operating height of around 15,000ft making it immune to interception until fighter Squadrons were recalled from the front, including No.56 Squadron equipped with Bristol Fighters and Sopwith Camels. McCudden's difficult experience with Gothas is outlined in Grey and Thetford's "German Aircraft of the First World War."

By WW1 standards this must have seemed like the end of the world when it went off.

In one instance, on a raid on Kaiserlautern, a 1,600 pounder wiped out an entire factory.

[Glider]

I think you will find that the 0400 had a ventral gun position, not as specialised as the Gotha but sufficient for the job.

[Graeme]

I think you will find that the 0400 had a ventral gun position, not as specialised as the Gotha but sufficient for the job.

Thanks Glider, I was unaware of that fact. Trying to locate it on a cutaway wasn't easy either...gunners "ventral hatch" (No. 63) just below the "ammunition stowage" (No.62).

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

This story kinda proves what others have said about the Sopwith Pup having weak firing power. One gun would be hard to take a bomber down.

[Lucky13]

Interesting thread! How would the Caproni Ca.5 compare to these?

[Glider]

What I find interesting is the comment about firing all his ammunition 47 rounds. Most Lewis guns in the RFC/RNAS had double this and had 97 rounds per drum. I don't know when they changed but it seems to be later than I thought.

[Graeme]

I don't know when they changed but it seems to be later than I thought.

Hi Glider. The above event occurred on 5th July 1917.

Interesting thread! How would the Caproni Ca.5 compare to these?

A good aircraft from what I've read Lucky. Made a considerable contribution to the overall Italian war effort, not least in support of the Italian ground forces. Modest in speed and bombload, many of its operations were against distant targets, involving long and often hazardous flights over the Alps and over equally inhospitable terrain. Good endurance, reliable and able to absorb considerable battle damage and still return safely. The engines were accessible for emergency repairs on long-range bombing flights and well armed, although I wouldn’t be putting my hand up for the rear gunner’s position. A position described by H.F.King as only for the “hardy” individual...

[vikingBerserker]

I think the O/400 is an excellent plan, but I really have to go with the Gotha as well. It would however, be interesting to add Sikorsky's 'Llya Murometz' into the comparisons.

[BombTaxi]

I would go with the Gotha, if only for it's impact on the development of strategic bombing. The RAF's 'Independent Force' did achieve some singular successes with the 0/400, but the G.IV was one of the first types to take part in a sustained strategic bombing campaign. M/C rates were less than spectacular, but that is perhaps to be expected given the novelty of aviation in general and this type of aircraft/mission in particular.

The G.IV was not, I believe, the first heavier-than-air type to attack an enemy city - I believe a Taube attacked Paris (albeit with bombs little bigger than hand grenades) early in the war. I also understand there was very limited use of aircraft in the Balkan wars immediately prior to WWI, and possibly in N.Africa/ME around the same time? Not sure if these were used to attack settlements though. Can anyone shed any light on this

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Thanks for the tip BombTaxi! I changed it now.

[BombTaxi]

No problem, I knew all of my obscure knowledge about WWI would be useful someday

[Graeme]

No problem, I knew all of my obscure knowledge about WWI would be useful someday

Excellent! Maybe you can help me with this BT Do you know where the Friedrichshafen FF29 (although one source says it was a Taube) that did this, flew from? (Or was it transported part of the way by the Navy?)...

[BombTaxi]

Gah, answer is in a book somewhere and I'm just on my way out... I'll have a look and get back to you