Peace under any negotiated circumstances ..?

[michaelmaltby]

In a separate, unrelated thread, Parsifal wrote: "... Rommel's strategy was elegantly simple, and might have worked. Tanks are an inherently offensive weapon....Rommel was saying, lets ditch the offensive and get into the right position for a peace settlement".

I was not aware of this view of Rommel's. It got me thinking and so I pose this hypothetical question to the membership: Can anyone foresee any
circumstances under which Nazi Germany would have been able to sue for peace with Britain, Russia and the USA while Churchill and Stalin
(and FDR) were the leaders of their respective nations?

Given the chronology of WW1 and the events building up to the start of WW2, I cannot.

Thoughts ....

MM

[stona]

Nazi Germany...no,not a chance.
Steve

[fastmongrel]

To be honest Germany got away with it the original plans for the peace would have been much much worse. Ironic isnt it that the threat of Stalinism meant Germany was rebuilt in the way it was.

[michaelmaltby]

".... Germany got away with it the original plans for the peace would have been much much worse."

The so-called Morgenthau Plan. Would have de-industrialized Germany and the Ruhr. The Daimler Benz Uni-Mog is an artifact of those immediate
post-war plans when DB engineers were scrambling for an "agricultural" product.

MM

[stona]

The so-called Rosenthal Plan
MM

Morgenthau plan.
Steve

[michaelmaltby]

Thanks, stona. He was FDR's neighbor in the Hanpshires.

[davebender]

"Nazi" has little to do with it. FDR, Churchill and Stalin were determined to destroy the nations of Central Europe and give the rubble to the Soviet Union. The only hope for a negotiated peace was to maintain German control over Central Europe until after FDR dies.

[buffnut453]

"Nazi" has little to do with it. FDR, Churchill and Stalin were determined to destroy the nations of Central Europe and give the rubble to the Soviet Union. The only hope for a negotiated peace was to maintain German control over Central Europe until after FDR dies.

Huh???

[stona]

"Nazi" has little to do with it. FDR, Churchill and Stalin were determined to destroy the nations of Central Europe and give the rubble to the Soviet Union. The only hope for a negotiated peace was to maintain German control over Central Europe until after FDR dies.

Huh? ......I'll go one better,Rubbish.
Steve

[stona]

Thanks, stona. He was FDR's neighbor in the Hanpshires.

No worries, I knew who you meant.
Cheers
Steve

[Edgar Brooks]

"Nazi" has little to do with it. FDR, Churchill and Stalin were determined to destroy the nations of Central Europe and give the rubble to the Soviet Union. The only hope for a negotiated peace was to maintain German control over Central Europe until after FDR dies.

That has to be one of the most offensive pieces of drivel that I've read in a long time. By the time of FDR's last conference, he was so ill he should not have gone; when he and Stalin started their "negotiations" for Eastern Europe, Churchill walked out in fury. By then, of course, the "big two" saw Churchill/Britain as an irrelevance, so behaved accordingly. Churchill always planned to honour his promises to Poland, Czechoslovakia, etc., but the British electorate slung him out, and lumbered us with a purblind, Soviet-loving Labour government, who reneged on every promise.
Edgar

[michaelmaltby]

".... That has to be one of the most offensive pieces of drivel that I've read in a long time".

Agreed. Churchill was many things, but he was not a betrayer, he was not a conspirator, he was not a blinkered Anglophile. He was a supreme PRAGMATIST. And pragmatists are always appreciated at the moment and condemned as hypocrits when the danger has passed.

MM

[michaelmaltby]

But to return to the thrust of the thread for a moment, the hopes of the conspirators who would have assassinated Hitler after 1941 and sued for Peace were misplaced, I believe -- given the chronology of the 20th century. Had they succeeded I believe they still would have been faced with occupation, partition and unconditional surrender.

MM

[stona]

The deals were done before the "Khaki" election.

Unconditional surrender for a new German government? Possibly,the best they could have hoped for would have been terms that didn't look much different to that anyway.

Steve

[Njaco]

Only chance - and very slim it might be - was if Hitler had died, say July '44. That would be a very remote chance for Nazi Germany to be able to sue for peace with Britain, Russia and the USA. And I would exclude USSR as even if negotations had occurred due to Hitler passing, Stalin would not stop.