1948 Israel-what combat aircraft would you pick?

[IdahoRenegade]

Image it's early 1948. You are named to lead what will become the Israeli Air Force and defend your people from a genocide. Your land is surrounded by multiple violent Islamic states that want to deny you the right to exist, that want to exterminate all your people. You have no army, no armor, no aircraft-only small arms. While your enemies have been armed by the British with the latest British equipment-both armor and aircraft. They have trained your enemies leadership and in come cases lead their forces. They greatly outnumber you. You will be recognized as an independent nation per UN charter on May 15th. You know your enemies want to eliminate your (soon to be) nation from the face of the earth.

Now, further imagine that your nation wasn't suffering from a weapons embargo-one enforced by the armed forces of the US and Great Britain. Further image that the US and GB were willing to sell you their surplus military aircraft for pennies on the dollar, as they did so many other nations. Lets throw the Soviet Union's aircraft in the mix as well.

Lets further say you can only pick one combat aircraft type (let's assume you have some transports and observation planes). It will have to fight enemy fighter aircraft and defend against enemy bombers. It will also have to attack the armor and ground forces invading your homeland. Attack enemy air bases and other strategic targets. You are a tiny nation without a lot of manpower, with few manufacturing resources. And you have only a few pilots, so ensuring their survival is a major factor.

OK, have at it-what aircraft would you pick, and why?

 

[SaparotRob]

F-80C. I think that's the best American jet available at the time so that might be tough. Although how wrong could you go with an F51-H?

 

[Sisu]

What kinds of fighters and bombers are available to the "multiple violent Islamic states" of the time? I'm surprised that I don't know this, but...

 

[IdahoRenegade]

What kinds of fighters and bombers are available to the "multiple violent Islamic states" of the time? I'm surprised that I don't know this, but...

I know Egypt had Spitfires and Short Stirlings. Beyond that I'm not sure.

 

[Clayton Magnet]

I believe that Egypt used C-47's as bombers

 

[glennasher]

I think, due to having to use it for ground attack, and as an interceptor, I'd have to go with either the P-47 or Tempest. The range of a P-51 isn't needed, due to the size of the country, so I think the others would probably be the most suitable, for the many needs outlined. There is no "perfect" choice, you're going to have to make compromises.

 

[IdahoRenegade]

I like your thoughts.As you said, extreme range isn't necessary. Very high altitude probably not that important-the enemy didn't have a lot of high-altitude bombers. Ruggedness, very good firepower (for ground attack/CAS role) and a large bomb load is. I'd probably rule out liquid cooled engines due to more susceptibility to damage. Even though the nation was tiny, it was so fragmented by the weird partition plans if shot down and forced to bail out the odds were pretty good that you'd be in enemy-held territory.

My pick would probably be the Corsair, even though not used from carriers. It was as, or more rugged than even the '47, didn't have the massive turbocharger/intercooler system (not needed for low/mid level operation), had 4 20mm cannon in later versions and carried a very large bomb load. P-38 wouldn't be bad-but due to twin engines and systems I'd assume it needed a lot more maintenance hours. KISS is a big deal with very limited manpower. '47 would be good, but I don't recall it having a very large bomb load.

Is there any spec for maintenance hours per flight hour comparing the various WWII fighters?

 

[SaparotRob]

I like your thoughts.As you said, extreme range isn't necessary. Very high altitude probably not that important-the enemy didn't have a lot of high-altitude bombers. Ruggedness, very good firepower (for ground attack/CAS role) and a large bomb load is. I'd probably rule out liquid cooled engines due to more susceptibility to damage. Even though the nation was tiny, it was so fragmented by the weird partition plans if shot down and forced to bail out the odds were pretty good that you'd be in enemy-held territory.

My pick would probably be the Corsair, even though not used from carriers. It was as, or more rugged than even the '47, didn't have the massive turbocharger/intercooler system (not needed for low/mid level operation), had 4 20mm cannon in later versions and carried a very large bomb load. P-38 wouldn't be bad-but due to twin engines and systems I'd assume it needed a lot more maintenance hours. KISS is a big deal with very limited manpower. '47 would be good, but I don't recall it having a very large bomb load.

Is there any spec for maintenance hours per flight hour comparing the various WWII fighters?

Good choice. Were Lend Lease Corsairs still around or had they all been pushed over side by this time? Still, there should be a bunch left.

 

[EwenS]

Good choice. Were Lend Lease Corsairs still around or had they all been pushed over side by this time? Still, there should be a bunch left.

The last FAA front line squadrons disbanded after flying their aircraft ashore in England when their parent carriers arrived home in July / Aug 1946. After that there was only the odd airframe like KD431 in technical schools.

14 squadron RNZAF continued to fly them as part of the British Commonwealth Occupation Force in Japan until they were piled up and burnt on 10 October 1948. Any survivors in New Zealand to be sold off the following year.

 

[BiffF15]

I think there are several ways you could skin this cat.

F4U-5: Plenty available, air cooled simplicity, heavy armament, decent legs, fast and good rate of climb
P-51D/H: Plenty available, water cooled but known quantity, fast, good armament long legs
F8F: Fast, air cooled, great climb rate, strong armament
Hawker Sea Fury: Just rolling off the production line, might be difficult to secure early production slots. Fast, air cooled, heavy armaments
Spitfire: Later marks, great climb, fast, agile

The P-51 due to its range, could fly standing patrols that the others might not be capable of (F4U with two externals?)
Your early warning network might drive your choices, or what your enemy is fielding, or you might be limited to only what's available. Also if you are recruiting there is plenty of talent available with experience in or working on type for most of the above as well as command and control.

Had you started a bit earlier there would be a mass of Fw190s and or Me109s and related supplies to draw upon.

 

[special ed]

F4U-7 for France, last production 1947.

 

[EwenS]

I think there are several ways you could skin this cat.

F4U-5: Plenty available, air cooled simplicity, heavy armament, decent legs, fast and good rate of climb
P-51D/H: Plenty available, water cooled but known quantity, fast, good armament long legs
F8F: Fast, air cooled, great climb rate, strong armament
Hawker Sea Fury: Just rolling off the production line, might be difficult to secure early production slots. Fast, air cooled, heavy armaments
Spitfire: Later marks, great climb, fast, agile

The P-51 due to its range, could fly standing patrols that the others might not be capable of (F4U with two externals?)
Your early warning network might drive your choices, or what your enemy is fielding, or you might be limited to only what's available. Also if you are recruiting there is plenty of talent available with experience in or working on type for most of the above as well as command and control.

Had you started a bit earlier there would be a mass of Fw190s and or Me109s and related supplies to draw upon.

The first Israeli fighter squadron received Avia S.199 (Czech built Me109G airframes with Jumo 211 engines) a few days after Israel declared independence.

Avia S-199 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Frog]

F4U-7 for France, last production 1947.

No way for 1948 : the XF4U7 first flew on july 1st, 1952. End of production : january 31, 1953.

 

[GreenKnight121]

F-4U would also be my choice - specifically the F4U-4 or the F4U-5/5N.

2,037 standard F4U-4s were produced from 1944-47, with 297 more having 4x20mm M2 cannon instead of the 6x.50cal mgs that most had. Only 1 radar-equipped F4U-4N was built, but more could be ordered if necessary.

568 F4U-5s were built (all with 4x20mm M3 (T-31) cannon) from 1946 on: 223 day fighters, 214 "plain" radar-equipped F4U-5N night fighters, and 101 cold-weather equipped F4U-5NLs (also radar-equipped), plus 30 F4U-5P photo-recon birds.
All F4U-5s had an improved engine & supercharger, with a ceiling of 45,000 feet and a speed at 26,800 feet of 469 mph - and a maximum of 5,000 pounds of external ordnance.

The AU-1 was a pure ground-attack version, and entered production too late (all for the USMC).

The F4U-7, as mentioned above, was way too late.

 

[IdahoRenegade]

F-4U would also be my choice - specifically the F4U-4 or the F4U-5/5N.

2,037 standard F4U-4s were produced from 1944-47, with 297 more having 4x20mm M2 cannon instead of the 6x.50cal mgs that most had. Only 1 radar-equipped F4U-4N was built, but more could be ordered if necessary.

568 F4U-5s were built (all with 4x20mm M3 (T-31) cannon) from 1946 on: 223 day fighters, 214 "plain" radar-equipped F4U-5N night fighters, and 101 cold-weather equipped F4U-5NLs (also radar-equipped), plus 30 F4U-5P photo-recon birds.
All F4U-5s had an improved engine & supercharger, with a ceiling of 45,000 feet and a speed at 26,800 feet of 469 mph - and a maximum of 5,000 pounds of external ordnance.

The AU-1 was a pure ground-attack version, and entered production too late (all for the USMC).

The F4U-7, as mentioned above, was way too late.

Thanks for the info. I'm curious-what was done to modify the aircraft for pure ground-attack? Thanks.

 

[marathag]

SAAB 21
British and US would probably not be willing to sell new, but only surplus.
It's faster than the S-199, better climb rate and less of a beast to handle. Similar range
Could be had in a ground attack version with racks for Rockets and bombs

 

[glennasher]

I confess I hadn't even thought about the Corsair, in any of it's variants. it would be a better choice than the T-bolt or the Tempest. I think of the Corsair as a naval aircraft, and I dismissed it. Shame on me for that. On second thought, it probably IS a better choice than my other two choices. Any of those three would work pretty well, I'd think.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

P-47. Capable fighter and ground-attack as well. Rugged too. Range (or lack of) not so relevant in this theater.

 

[Frog]

Thanks for the info. I'm curious-what was done to modify the aircraft for pure ground-attack? Thanks.

The XF4U-6 that became AU was characterised by : the guns fixed to slightly fire downward, reinforcement of the armor protection, removal of the useless wing radar wiring. For the rest, a classic F4U.

Along with the 94 F4U-7s, the French Navy received 69 AU-1s.

 

[GrauGeist]

I would think that the Hellcat, like the F6F-5, might work for Israel.

It was a solid performer, proved itself more than capable both in aerial combat as well as ground attack and was readily available in numbers and parts at war's end.