"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (4 Viewers)

[XBe02Drvr]

The West is funding and supplying and supporting Ukraine in this war. That's an act of war in itself. Russia is fighting NATO by proxy.

So NATO has the whip hand and has a lot more in this fight. So absolutely NATO can dictate terms. Ukraine would be back to 2014 if NATO suddenly gave up.

NATO may theoretically have the whip hand, but in practical terms? It's in NATO's interest to keep Ukraine in the fight. Risking a Ukrainian defeat by withholding support just to force Zelensky to negotiate to NATO's terms is like throwing out the baby with the bath water. Duhh!

 

[XBe02Drvr]

Ugggh! Yeah, stupid typo. I need to use my laptop and not my phone. He said that he wants the US and NATO to declare terms. I meant to ask how he thought they could do that. They cannot.

Don't you just love auto-correct? You proofread your words before you hit POST REPLY, then it pops up on the thread "corrected"! AARRGGH!! Often the "corrections" make no sense at all, just R2D2 trying to read your mind and put words in your mouth. I would delete him if Samsung and 'droid would let me. It seems each generation of these infernal gadgets has more automation and less user control of its features.

 

[The Basket]

That depends on your definition of defeat is.

I would fully suspect Ukraine and NATO would happily support any peace treaty that's favourable.

How long do you think Ukraine would have lasted without the support of NATO? Seconds? Minutes? Hours?

Again NATO is fighting the war through Ukraine. Because it suits NATO to do so.

This is what annoys me. When we talk about Chamberlain and Munich.

The British Empire couldn't give two hoots about Czechoslovakia. Couldn't care less even if it tried. So it was no care at all to throw away the Czechs.

No replace Czech with say Gibraltar and war would have begun straight away.

We declared war when Poland was invaded because it was the only option. Again the British Empire couldn't give two hoots about Poland.

So it wasn't appeasement but the Germans were not messing with our stuff so we didn't care.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Acceptable in the idea that things could be worse. Not acceptable in that things are good.

My father in law had bad cancer. He was given 2 choices. Be cut up or die.

He got plenty cut up. I can say that you wouldn't want that one bit. But it was acceptable because of the alternative.

NATO can tell Ukraine to do whatever it wants. It is the money and power behind Ukraine. So Ukraine must do what NATO says or be cut off.

Now there maybe a window of opportunity coming up soon. From what I read by 1st June, if war continued then Russia will be totally and utterly exhausted. There ability to fight a conventional war is so degraded as to be worthless. Let's see what happens then.

Things could be worse? It would just be a temporary peace buying time for Russia to get their shit together.

 

[WARSPITER]

Britain and France had a treaty with Poland that was honoured. If they didn't care they would not have honoured it.

 

[SaparotRob]

Trouble In Kremlin Gulag: Spy Boss Reportedly Arrested As Putin Fumes Over Ukraine Invasion

Vladimir Putin isn't happy, and it's triggering infighting and upheaval in his government.

www.yahoo.com

Trouble in worker's paradise?

 

[SaparotRob]

According to Russia the flight suits are yellow cos they yellow.

They don't signifies nothing.

Very very strange though.

One of the cosmonauts said the suits were yellow because the had a lot of yellow spacesuit material left. They had to use it up.
That's what the translation said.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

So it wasn't appeasement but the Germans were not messing with our stuff so we didn't care.

No. Czechoslovakia was dismembered because the British lacked the strength of arms and the French lacked the political will to fight. Britain gave Poland a guarantee because it realized Germany had become the continental hegemon and the UK reverted to its traditional policy of counterbalancing such a hegemon with an alliance.

Czechoslovakia got mutilated because the Allies were negotiating from a position of weakness.

Now, the longer the Ukrainians hold out, the weaker the Russians become. That rather changes one's negotiating position and tactics. What seems reasonable to you may well be completely unacceptable to Ukrainians for reasons non-Ukrainians might never understand. National and cultural identities matter when you're talking about the will of a people.

 

[Denniss]

Just to make things straight - If Putler is not stopped now he or his follow-up clone will endanger other nations around Russia in the near future, especially those without a protective defense treaty.
Imagine what would have happened if germany would have been sanctioned after their Sudetenland or whole Czech takeover? They were exzessivly depending on oil and rare metals imports. The Luftwaffe and tank units were still building-up and required lots of fuel to train/operate, synth fuel factories had rather limited production, ties with Romania were not that strong that they would have worked around sanctions and deliver oil.

 

[wlewisiii]

 

[wlewisiii]

 

[msxyz]

German punctuality at work... They should have left a guarantee coupon as well for the new owners...

 

[Dimlee]

The only reason Ukraine is doing as well as it is because NATO are sending billions of dollars worth of arms to them. Probably also intel and who knows what else. Money and supplies by the truck load.

The only reason? Many more billions were spent in Afghanistan.

 

[The Basket]

Russia may get weaker may get stronger who knows. But buys time for Ukraine as well. Time for Russia to fail due to sanctions.

If the British Empire cared for the Czechs then it wouldn't have sold them down the river. Let's judge on actions and the actions are pretty clear.

As advised before...they didn't care and why should they?

Again didn't care about Poland but a line in the sand was drawn so...

If it became obvious Hitler was nuts then it was time to step in.

Again and again and again....how are you going to stop Putin and the Russian military? Please tell me how you are going to do it?

 

[The Basket]

The only reason? Many more billions were spent in Afghanistan.

If NATO was not backing Ukraine fully with money and weapons then Ukraine would do as well as it did in 2014.

 

[SaparotRob]

Think good thoughts?

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

That theater that was clearly marked "kids" that the Russians bombed?

Here's what it looks like now:

War in Ukraine: Russian forces hit a shelter in Mariupol

Ukrainian officials say Russian troops bombed an art school in the besieged city of Mariupol. Some 400 people had taken shelter there. It's unclear how many may have been wounded or killed in the strike.

www.npr.org

Ukrainian authorities report approximately 130 people saved out of an estimated 1,300 sheltering there when it got attacked. I hope every single person in the decision-chain of that attack gets life in prison with no parole.

 

[ARTESH]

That crime needs punishment way more stronger than just a few seconds in prison!

Not only every single person in chain of command, but also all of guards, ground crews, intelligence officers, and anyone else included, has to be executed in most fearsome way as an active revenge response, not only themselves, but also their families.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

That crime needs punishment way more stronger than just a few seconds in prison!

Not only every single person in chain of command, but also all of guards, ground crews, intelligence officers, and anyone else included, has to be executed in most fearsome way as an active revenge response, not only themselves, but also their families.

That's too easy. I want these guys to spend long lives behind bars, without sunlight, pondering their role in this barbarity. Preferably as Hess was jailed in Spandau, or Kacinsky is jailed here in America: 23 hours in a windowless room, one hour outside for PT.

 

[GrauGeist]

If NATO was not backing Ukraine fully with money and weapons then Ukraine would do as well as it did in 2014.

Nope - you saw how well Ukraine did at stopping Russia from stealing their land in 2014.
Since then, they have been helped with training and equipment by Western nations and it's showing.

So here's a thought: let's just say f**k it and let Russia have the Ukraine. All Russia wants, is to have a "demilitarized" region.
Oh, and there are ethnic Russian enclaves in Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia - so let's kick NATO out of those states and demilitarized them so Russia can feel safe.
Oops, almost forgot about Poland, can't have them keeping Russians up at night worrying abot those pesky Poles, so they need to be kicked out of NATO and demilitarized too.
Ahh..now Romania and Hungary are worrysome to the Kremlin, too. So off they go and wait, didn't Russia claim Bulgaria as their rightful territory at one time? Those three obviously need to be brought back in the fold of Mother Russia, because "reasons".

So where do we stop?
Finland?
Germany?
Macedonia?
Serbia?
Croatia?

Or should we just let Russia do whatever the f**k they want so we can sit at home without interruption to our own daily lives and let those people in far off lands do the suffering for us?