Mossie vs Ju88

[Erich]

not real sure but note the the cites where they are established, quite the huge content of Flak so this could easily be a no fly or no parachute zone if damged and having to bail....

yeah good luck to that

♫

 

[Erich]

the Gibb/Kendall report after action with their Mossie XXX nf. Obsltlt. Borchers was shot down and killed by a Mossie as well as Domminger and his crew of 3./NJG 5. Both German a/c were Ju 88G-6's. Borchers was a noted ace in NJG 5 with the Ritterkreuz. Thanks to friend S. Smith for the report.

 

[v2]

Extra Erich.
J hope that you remember about my question?

 

[Gnomey]

Good stuff as usual Erich, interesting read.

 

[Erich]

v2 ask your question again please......it is lost in the shuffle

 

[v2]

Dear Erich,

On 25th September 1943, over Bay of Biscay, four crews from 307th(Polish) Sqn clashed with eight Ju 88Cs from 15./KG 40. Polish crews claimed 2-2-1, with Mosquito VI HJ658 lost ( RAF crew - F/Sgt. L.J. Loundes and F/Sgt. I. Cotton was KIA).

In some old Polish book I found info, that seven of eight Ju 88Cs never returned from this mission. So, maybe You have info about real V./KG 40 losses on that day ?

 

[Erich]

I have a freind that I believe has the KTB on the KG unit from Freiburg, I will send him a note

E

 

[v2]

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Interesting, I am going to try and find out what the parachutes mean.

 

[v2]

Yes it's realy interesting. Now I read this book.

 

[Erich]

14/15 February 1945 over Chemnitz, info provided by reseach friend Rod M, whom has a huge data base

(1) AIR 14/3745 - 'Bomber Command Interception Tactics Report Nr. 35/45'
13/14 February 1945
(report dated 18th Feb 45)

Claims:

100 Grp Mosquito (high level) - 2 x Me.110 claimed destroyed, N of Frankfurt

Bombers (Bohlen) - no claims noted (i.e. accepted). Attacks Combats:-
1. leaving Bohlen, 2200hrs, 1 attack by U/I E/A
2. leaving Bohlen, 2200hrs, 1 combat with S/E E/A
3. Homeward - east of Bonn, 2335hrs, attack by 1 T/E E/A
4. Homeward - over Belgium, 0035hrs, 1 U/I E/A was fired on

Bombers (Dresden 1st raid) - no claims noted (i.e. accepted). Attacks Combats:-
1. Outward - east of Dusseldorf, 2103hrs, 1 combat with E/A
2. Outward - east of Dusseldorf, 2110hrs, 1 combat with E/A
3. Outward - south of Madgeburg, 2145hrs, 1 attack by T/E E/A
4. Outward - south of Madgeburg, 2150hrs, 1 combat with suspected jet A/C (8 bombers reported seeing 4 x jet a/c between 1000E and Dresden, but no attacks or combats)
5. Target - 10 S/E T/E E/A sighted but no attacks or combats.

Bombers (Dresden 2nd raid) - no claims noted. Attacks Combats:-
1-4. Outward - near the Rhine, 0033-0059hrs, 3 attacks 1 combat with E/A
5. Outward - south of Schweinfurt, 0103hrs, 1 attack by E/A
6. Outward - ?, 0112hrs, 1 combat with Ju.88
7. Target - 0134hrs, 1 combat with S/E E/A
8. Target - 0142hrs, 1 attack by T/E E/A
9. Homeward - south-east of Stuttgart, 0238hrs, 1 attack by Ju.88
10. Homeward - south-east of Stuttgart, 0254hrs, 1 attack by Ju.88
11. Homeward - south of Stuttgart, 0313hrs, 1 combat with Ju.88
12. Homeward - west of Strasbourg, 0413hrs, 1 combat with T/E E/A

As can be seen, no claims were acknowledged by returning Bombers on this night.

(2) AIR 14/3745 - 'Bomber Command Interception Tactics Report Nr. 36/45'
14/15 February 1945
(report dated 20th Feb 45)

Claims:

100 Grp Mosquito (high level) - 1 x Ju.88 claimed destroyed NE Schwabsich Hall at 0009 hrs

Fighter Command Mosquito (high level) - 1 x He.219 claimed destroyed Se of Gottingen

Fighter Command Mosquito (low level) - 1 x T/E A/C claimed damaged on ground

Bombers (Rositz) - Claims: 1 x T/E A/C claimed probably destroyed over target between approx 2005-2008+ hrs
1 x T/A E/A claimed probably destroyed N. Frankfurt at 2112+ hrs.

Bombers (Chemnitz 1st attack - homeward route) - 1 x Ju88 claimed probably destroyed over target at 2117+ hrs

The Interception Tactics Reports were prepared by the RAF 'Operational Research Section' and matched closely the official 'night raid reports' issued by Bomber Command Headquarters. If a claim is not included in this or the final report then it is highlt unlikely that the claim was allowed. One reason for non-approval of claims would be if a bomber, inside a stream, made claims for aircraft destroyed or damaged but the claim went unwitnessed by all the bombers in the stream around them.

All returning RAF crews were required to report all sightings during debriefing and these reports were collated and analysed higher up the chain of command.

Thus, a Squadron ORB is NOT the best place to start when looking for verification of a claim...as the claim may have been denied after examination.

Although one suspected combat did take place, Bomber Command did not recognise ANY claim against a jet a/c on the night of either 13/14 or 14/15 February 1945.

 

[Gnomey]

Interesting stuff as usual Erich, keep it coming. Interesting that no claims for bombers where accepted this night.

 

[Erich]

at least seen through Mossie NF eyes Gnomey. Actually there were German nf "kills" this night though I am finding this evenings raid quite confusing, part of the massive Thunderclap raids done by RAF bomber command and the heavies during the day from US 8th Air Force.

German Nachtjägers were more successful on "Gardening" preventitives / against RAF command performing mining duties and this is where I./NJG 3 and their Ju 88G-6's accounted for 6 RAF a/c: 5 halibag's and 1 lancaster confirmed. 3 German pilots accounted for the destruction of the RAF bombers.

NJG 5 and NJG 6 were the only other two NJG's making calims for RAF bombers over the Böhen and Chemnitz raid areas and it was lame at best with 8 claims, 1 a B-17 but a B-17 did not fly on this mission so ID was not obviously real good on the part of the German pilot whom by the way was and is a Ritterkreuz recipient, still living.

 

[Gemhorse]

Truly exceptional postings Erich, I'm thoroughly engrossed !!....

One point, RAF 139 Sqn. began the first installation of H2S sets in Jan. 1944, after using GH since Oct. 1943. Bennett's intention was to groom 139 Sqn. to become the Marker Sqn. for the LNSF.....

Also, the Mosquito appears to have had the lowest loss-rate of the War, 8 Group losses alone, for example, being only 0.4%....not bad for an unarmed wooden bomber......

Unfortunately, I've only my Bomber Command stuff on hand at the moment, Fighter Command is out on loan - But I continue to be rivetted to your comments....Awesome !........

 

[lesofprimus]

I agree Gem...

 

[Erich]

this time a 406th sqd report from September 43. Look how busy the German airfield was this night.....from the data of friend and researcher Mark Huxtable

 

[Gnomey]

Interesting stuff Erich! Really interesting reading. That airfield saw a lot of action that night.

 

[evangilder]

Heck of a night!

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Damn I wish I access to documents like that. Really puts a new light on things. Its not the stuff that you find in books or what not.

 

[Erich]

here is another one from my good friend M. Huxt. this for 5 of march 1945 on the Chemnitz raid. although a Ju 88G-6 destroyed it is quite unclear actually which one it was. Hauptmann Weigel flying a 88G-6, staffelkapitän of 11./NJG 6 and his crew slammed into a low hill but the demise is unclear, whether bad weather as the visibilty had closed in or was it due to the Mossie flown by the gent in the combat report present ?